Ice tool vs ice axe reddit.
Do not get an adze on either one.
Ice tool vs ice axe reddit Agree with all the recommendations about browsing resale or at least shopping a sale, an ice axe is an ice axe but the BD Raven Pro or Petzl Summit are the go-to's for me. C. So i have one axe for everything. Fully curved climbing axe pair with an adze and hammer, a very robust hybrid with a slightly taller and less piercing point than the sum'tec for hard ice and glaciers, and the camp microtech corsa for those lighter trips. It is easy to use in piolet canne mode with its stainless steel spike and its slightly curved shaft. Jan 28, 2022 · The number of different modular-headed ice axes has increased in the past few years, and manufacturers are responding to this rapidly growing hybrid category. The Black Diamond Raven is a simple design with a long pick that bites into snow and ice as well as a wide grip area, making it comfortable to carry and more secure in the The raptors have a protruding 3rd tooth as well. 35 votes, 13 comments. You can do this with a curved shaft but it's not quite as effective. Type B ice axes are for general mountaineering. I none of the axes I regularly use fit into this rule, they are all shorter. They'll serve you better and you'll enjoy the sport more. "The TiCa Ice Tool is not a replacement for a UIAA-certified ice axe on technical terrain and should not be used where life or safety is at risk. system, superior shaft geometry, adjustable grip, and durable picks make it a standout in the world of ice Before axes and crampons were developed enough to go on steep ice, 50cm was unheard of. One tool can accomplish both of these tasks, but in our world of optimization and nuance, we can choose which tools we own or bring on a certain day based on the day’s needs. If you're going to ice climb you'll end up on tools like Nomics. standard ice tools: Learning to Ice Climb up to WI3-4 for alpine objectives I'll be moving to New York shortly and am planning on taking advantage of the copious amount of ice accessible in the northeast this winter by learning to ice climb. The major difference is ice axes compared to ice tools. Ice tools are specifically designed to climb ice. It is super important that you buy an ice axe that is the proper length. As such, don’t fall into the trap of getting a “cane”. Feb 12, 2024 · This traditional ice axe has amazing quality for its great price, which is a good $30 lower than the average ice axe and the reason we have ranked it the best budget ice axe. Ice Tools range in use from ice climbing, technical mountaineering, mixed climbing, or dry tooling. So, straight shaft and classic pick with negative pick clearance as my primary glacier travel tool. A second tool could be a more technical tool and typically that'd be a A curved shaft ice axe can make it easier to self arrest (ie petzl summit). Personal preference. The carbon fiber Grivel alpine tools are also pretty nice. Ice axes aren't used for ice climbing. I think the interesting thing about this one is the claw-hammer-like adze. I did as well when I had them. Whatever long axe you can afford will serve you well. e. If I am just mountaineering (glacier travel, steep snow) I use a Petzl Summit. I have Petzl Nomics on my radar but I'm open to any recommendations/advice. When self arresting correctly with the head of the axe at shoulder height the shaft should go under your armpit. Different styles of picks have different applications. It'll make proper self arresting more difficult. An ice climbing tool won’t be the best for mountaineering. But, I wouldn’t want to carry any ice tools for ski touring because they’re heavy - what do you want to do with a single ice tool while touring? We would like to show you a description here but the site won’t allow us. When the head is resting on the May 13, 2013 · After a rain-on-snow-event and subsequent hard freeze, I’d want an axe anyplace there was a fall risk with long slide potential, not ice tools. And you're right, an adze on the head is more useful for cutting steps on steep ice, bollards for descending etc. Great all around ice axe, handles steeper terrain, and is quite comfortable paired with an ice tool when it gets too steep for an axe alone. An ice axe is an important tool for moving safely on glaciers and steep snow slopes. Best to Have 2 Ice tools, an axe and one pole if your really moving through a variety of winter terrain. I think other companies made axes with a reverse curved pick and a straight shaft before the 90s, but I can’t find any evidence of a CAMP tool like this in the 80s. I feel more comfortable descending with the long axe handy. I've carried two tools and an axe before as the axe provides a much better self belay than poles. The venom is best for routes where you know you’ll need a basic axe, but there are also sections of slightly more technical terrain and ice. I also don't like the "all mountain" axes. A general mountaineering axe will be terrible for ice climbing. 10+ years of ice climbing will do that. The rubber handles inhibit plunging in snow but it'll work to self arrest. The Sum'tec is the brainchild of the late Ueli Steck (along Type B ice axes are for general mountaineering. The top of the line ergo ice tools make climbing so much easier, you can take your time and have fun without fighting for every placement. It is often used as a snow picket, an anchor, and also for self arrest. All Mountains are a great first tool. In that case the tool is often left hanging in the ice or on the other tool, over a shoulder, etc. But you will outgrow them eventually. Don't overthink tools. Tools are the easiest thing to borrow or trade between partners. The CAMP Corsa in one of the lightest certified ice axes on the market, but it is also probably the worst certified ice axe on the market. Jan 29, 2015 · 5) My ice tools are much more sharp and its just another annoying pokey thing to get snagged on while digging through your pack. The main thing that has yet to be commented is that during a self-arrest, which is the main reason you should carry an ice axe, those ice tools (the climbing ones) can bury their handles into the snow due to their shape and pop the head out. Hello everyone, this is going to be my first season ice climbing and I am deciding on which ice axes to get. Technical ice tools are pretty great for climbing steep technical ice but suck for just about anything else. Ice and mixed go well together and I’d recommend buying Quarks (I’m a broken record on that) in addition to your nomics. However they don’t replace ice tools for more difficult climbing. for the next 2 to 3 winter season (in los andes mind) i want to go in to technical mountaineering but. They should be your last purchase. How important is it to have curved ice tools? Is it possible to climb with glaciers comfortably? Thanks in advance! Then worry about tools. One thing to keep in mind is that your ice axe will most likely be on your backpack more than your hand. Get an ice axe that goes to around the bottom of your As for the high dagger argument most of the time when doing that in alpine your fingers will be in the snow so it'll be cold regardless That being said I'd buy Nomics and a third lightweight tool/ ax if I where you. Sep 5, 2024 · The Hydra Ice Tool by Black Diamond is more than just another ice tool—it’s a versatile, highly customizable piece of climbing equipment that can be tailored to meet the demands of any winter climbing objective. Good at nothing other than wearing many hats and softening the initial blow on one's wallet. Of course, if you end up buying 3 sets of axes instead of 2, maybe you don't save money. Mar 25, 2015 · I want a tool that self arrests well. while you place pro or do other things and dropping it is more likely. I bought a couple of Petzl sum'tec ice axes and build a new head made for snow, for self arresting. I was looking at either the Petzel Summit Evo, or SumTec. More important than the brand name of the axe is buy Yvonn Chouinard's excellent book Climbing Ice. See full list on outdoorgearlab. If you carry a long walking axe, you may find that you use trekking poles less -- and vice versa with the shirt tech axe. E. If you're a begginer and just going to do some laps on snow, there's no need for an ixe axe. It's inspirational as well as instructive. If I've only got the harness on for crevasse falls I don't use a tether. Do not get an adze on either one. So, whether that's an axe or a hammer will be personal preference, but, it won't be any tool that I'd currently have for ice climbing. There is some overlap between technical axes (like the north machine or quark for example) and ice climbing, but if you'll still end up with something not good most of the time, having the right tool for the job makes a huge difference. Make sure you don't buy one that is too tall. com Backpacks typically have straps designed to attach an ice axe or ice tools. a walking axe or a climbing axe. aka glacier travel, climbing couloirs, etc. A technical ice tool will have a much more extreme shaft and pick curve which both make self arrest difficult. Its kind of an intermediate between the two, but you're generally only going to carry one whereas with tools you'll usually have two or sometimes a tool and an axe. Michael Covington is on the cover climbing Mt Kilimanjaro I believe. Could well imagine adding a sum'tec, it's very sexy, and perhaps pure ice axes with no hammer or adze. Ice Climbing Fully curved climbing axe pair with an adze and hammer, a very robust hybrid with a slightly taller and less piercing point than the sum'tec for hard ice and glaciers, and the camp microtech corsa for those lighter trips. The easiest way to distinguish an ice axe from an ice tool is the shape of the pick. Keep these ice tools for pure ice climbing and get an ice axe for alpine climbing. i am in extrem bubget… Apr 11, 2024 · On other days, we may spend hours with one or two axes in use, perhaps climbing steps of ice or rock. If I'm climbing something steep, I will sometimes bring my traditional axe and one ice tool because I still want all the advantages of a traditional axe on approach and low angle sections. Non sketchy but would like a bit of a nicer hold while climbing - whippet Sketchy to point of needing one tool - ice axe Pretty sketchy with one tool - ice axe and whippet Two tools required - steep to near vertical ice Remember ice axe = boot crampons and a helmet. I see a good deal on Petzl Glaciers, however, it seems that curved ice axes are preferred. I am hoping to get some recommendations for a second ice axe/tool. Ice tools have reverse curve picks, sometimes referred to as negative curves. Your ice axe should come up to your knee with your boots or shoes on. For purely climbing ice why make it hard for yourself when you will have so much going on managing a new climbing environment. The long axe is not always used upright like a walking stick. An ice tool is typically shorter and more curved as compared to an ice axe. Pair of Hybrid Axes vs. Too many people buy 50cm axes and don't understand how big of a mistake they've made. Ice tools are used to climb steep/vertical ice. I am starting to get into climbing peaks with steeper slopes and am thinking I would like a second tool. They're a sweet tool for ice/ mixed and hell aren't much worse for self arrest then cobras/ vipers. Not as durable if you climb waterfall ice, but for alpine the weight savings are huge. All tools swing worse with a hammer IMO, even the micro hammers. Would be willing to climb just about anything shy of vertical ice with it, and even short pitches of ice haven't been a problem. An ice screw can be necessary for crevasse rescue. Central gulley in Huntington is a typical example, and its small ice bulge can be easily surmounted with a single axe. It's much harder with a straight tool, but it's very possible. Not what you wanna deal with leading ice. They're a decent entry level tool, but not even close to the nomic imo. You can get hybrids which it what your photo shows that can do easy climbs. I actually carry a real hammer if I'm going to be using pitons both because the tools swing better but also because modern ice tools make comically terrible hammers. The tiny ice tool hammers suck but at least they get the job done. The classic peak bagger of the golden age used 90-100cm, the current Euro mountaineer gets 65-70cm. If I am doing an alpine route (steep snow requiring two tools, ice and mixed climbing) I use Petzl Next step up is hybrid ice axe/leashed ice tool like the Petzl Quark, BD Venom or Stubai Hornet. As a beginner, without any friends practicing this sport to give me advice, the first ice axe I bought was a Petzl Summit Evo of 59cm. Depending on the terrains and routes you will encounter on your climb, it is typically unlikely that you can use an ice axe and an ice tool interchangeably. Beyond that, it's really just individual preference. It will work better For versatility I go with the Petzl Summit. Terrain constantly changes. It tends to cause overdrive and makes pulling the tool out extra challenging. We would like to show you a description here but the site won’t allow us. An ice tool is a specialized form of ice axe that’s used for vertical ice climbing. Bent shafted ice axes are generally nicer for daggering on hard snow / neve, since you can keep your hand at the bend at the shaft which keeps your hand off the snow. Ice axe should always be on your up hill side, and if you need more stability on the down hill side extend you trekking poles. Longer axes will facilitate descending and downclimbing. The ankle 'rule' is a guideline. Its innovative I. The handful of people I know who used then filed that tooth. If you can't climb ice with a mountaineering axe comfortably then the tools aren't going to make that much of a difference. For reference I'm 6' and use a 55cm axe. Here are the steps to secure the ice axe or ice tools: With the spike facing down, you slide the shaft all the way through the bottom strap or loop. It's just putting weight in the wrong place. Pretty much the same axe but some people are specific on brands, I regularly use my raven pro but jealous of my SOs summit cause it's a cool black lol I have a pair of nomics that I've used for pure ice for the last few years, but I recently moved to Colorado and I'm interested in doing moderate ice/mixed lines in RMNP (think Martha, Dreamweaver, Notch Couloir etc) as well as occasional trips to the PNW for moderate glaciated routes like the North Ridge of Mt Baker or the Reid Glacier Headwall on Mt. Some tools are closer to a traditional ice axe than others; like a Petzl Quark with the trig/hand rests removed. Hood. Posted by u/mortalwombat- - 23 votes and 37 comments. Get a non-technical ice axe. Yes, but actually tools are better. Petzl makes real axes that are quite light AND you can trust. ($110-$275) These are styled after the much shorter axes developed in the Alps for steep, hard snow and mixed terrain before the advent of modern ice tools. All of us pushing the more technical tools are doing so because we've got enough experience to adapt on low angle ice with tools made for vertical. Try different holds on the axe and go with what feels natural. The grip makes plunging hard if not impossible so you lose security in non technical terrain (ie petzl nomic). Most routes involve a lot more trekking where ski poles are handy and you only need an ice axe when the terrain gets steeper. Alpinism is usually better served by a tool like the Petzl Gully or Blue Ice Akila and ice climbing is better done by a tool like the Nomic or X Dream (or whatever Grivel is doing). . My advice would be to borrow, rent, or purchase a set of ice tools. The only real requirement is that you need an axe with which you can perform self-arrest maneuvers. Slicing your face open by accident is no fun. Plus, the miniature adze is a joke. I'm 173 cm height (5'8 ) I soon realised this ice axe was too long for the routes I'm taking, and now I'm selling it and looking for an alternative (or I might keep it for glaciers. And a classic straight ice axe will always be better for glacier travel and self arrest. essentially anything where you only need one to be an anchor or to self arrest a fall. I really started enjoying ice climbing a lot more after i went to a real ice tool. Generally speaking, this is the type of axe most people prefer, when they are only using one axe (no second tool - for slopes of ~50 degrees or less). The CT tools are going to be harder to find replacement picks for. Thanks! Either kind of axe is fine -- both types will get you started just as well. So far I have been relying on an old classical ice axe but I have noticed that people usually switch to ice tools on higher, more technical peaks such as Grossglockner, so I figured it's time for an upgrade. 100% agree with this. By bringing the venom on these sorts of routes you don’t have to carry extra shit. When secured, the head of the ice axe or tool should be at the bottom of your backpack. Go practice with them and get a feel for it. The bigger deciding factor is the type of pick you have. You'll also have different axes for different activities i. These tools are not made to be plunged into deep snow, therefore they are not appropriate for alpine climbing, especially for a beginner. I think the North Machines are magic on pure ice. I would also do lot's of crag ice climbing before doing glacial ice climbing. Dropping the axe in that situation could be bad, but in my limited experience it just doesn't happen. Petzl's Sum'tec description: "A compromise between a classic mountaineering ice axe and an ice climbing axe, the SUM’TEC is a versatile, lightweight, technical ice axe. They're used for self arresting a fall, as a walking/climbing aid in steep snow or easy ice and for building a T-slot anchor. Really don't over think tool choice. No model is as much of a blend between a traditional ice axe and an ice tool than the Petzl Sum'tec, and that's a good thing. All comes down to what you are climbing. ) My candidates: Petzl Gully Yeah, I was thinking that this axe was probably the same era as the X15s. There are different tools for different jobs. I currently just have a Petzl Glacier which is fine for flat and moderately steep terrain. A pick built for glacier travel won't swing into ice as easily as a pick built for ice climbing. " If I'm using an ice ax, it's because I'm in terrain where life or safety is at risk, otherwise I'd just be sticking with my poles. For less steep terrain I like a shorter ice axe with a curved handle. dwqugvtdavmoxraccwbjhpdowjamedmhfgzgfgcjfamabkfgbijyglf